Wednesday, July 13, 2011

Daily Headlines

First, we see the euro crisis growing by the day. Just yesterday it was Italy, now this:

Ireland downgraded to 'junk' in spiraling euro-crisis

US-based credit rating agency Moody's on Tuesday (11 July) downgraded Ireland's debt to junk status, amid growing market concerns about the stability of the eurozone as the debt crisis reaches Italy and Spain.

Citing the "growing possibility" that Ireland may need a second bailout at the end of 2013 and the "increased" likelihood that this bailout will require private sector participation, Moody's downgraded the country's rating by one notch to Ba1 status - meaning that its bonds are now considered "non-investment grade" and pensions funds, for instance, are no longer allowed to purchase them.

Moody's made the same move last week when it downgraded Portugal's rating by three notches to Ba2 status. Greece's rating is considerably lower - Caa1 which stands for "substantial risk", just three steps before what a rating agency considers "default" and with no perspective for investors to recover their money.

Solvency is a big problem in the southern countries - Greece, Portugal, Cyprus and Malta - but Italy, Spain and even France are also on a dangerous path, the study claims.

EU plans crisis summit as contagion fears grow

Financial markets hammered the euro and European assets on Tuesday after euro zone finance ministers opened the door to a possible Greek default and failed to prevent contagion spreading to Italy and Spain

The euro fell for a third straight day and diplomats said European Council president Herman Van Rompuy was trying to convene an emergency summit on Friday to deal with the latest dangerous lurch in the euro zone’s debt crisis.

“It is essential that euro area member states and the IMF act in the coming days to avoid market developments spinning out of control and risk contagion acceleration,” the Institute of International Finance (IIF), a major banking lobby, warned ministers in a report.

Fourth largest economy in Europe falters

We have all been aware of the problems of Greece, Spain, Ireland and Portugal; but how did Italy pop into the picture? It is the fourth largest economy in Europe and has among the highest standard of living in the world. Yet the telltale signs of a potential financial crisis have been in place for a number of years.

While Italy is not in the same boat with Greece (its insolvency index is: 2009: 24.8; 2101: 20.2; 2011: 24.3) the massive size of the Italian economy and the amount of euros needed to help that country would demolish the reserves of the Euro Zone and cause a potentially catastrophic financial crisis.

Just keep in mind - big crises lead to big changes, and big changes will be required for the EU to morph into the 10 kings stage. This is always worth remembering when viewing the developments in the EU.

In the rest of the world:

Iranian Officials: This is the Century of a Worldwide Islamic Awakening

The Iranian Supreme Leader, Ali Khamenei, addressing participants in Tehran's 28th International Holy Quran Contests, said on Tuesday that the revolutions and popular uprisings sweeping the Middle East and North Africa show that God definitely fulfills His promises.

He further emphasized that the regional nations' uprisings are a "clear indication of the fact that Allah's promises mentioned in the Holy Quran are definitely materialized."

Then on Wednesday, July 6th, the Iranian Supreme Leader's Advisor for Military Affairs, Major General Yahya Rahim Safavi, the ex-chief commander of the Guards, stated that the Muslim states' main share in control over the world's vital energy corridors has provided Islamic nations with an excellent chance to control the world economy.

He reminded the Islamic nations that their rich energy resources are their source of power, giving Muslims the capability to control the world economy.

This gets even more chilling, and almost reads as a "battle cry" by radical Islam:

Meantime, Islamic countries are located on both sides of these strategic bottlenecks, which we call 'compulsory passages.' Thus it can be said that Muslim states can come into control of the world economy."

"God willing, we should name the current century as the century of Islamic Awakening," Safavi underscored, adding that not only Egypt, Yemen, and Bahrain, but also a number of other nations in the Middle East and North Africa will eventually succeed in regaining power and controlling their fate in the next few years.

It is clear that the Iranian leaders are looking at the recent events in the Middle East with an eye to controlling the outcome to be one of anti-West sentiment, and that it will be played out to unite Muslims against Americans and Israelis.

With the radicals ruling Iran engaging us on several fronts: Iraq, Afghanistan, Lebanon, Libya and others; with Iran continuing to incite the populace in the region to overthrow U.S.-backed governments; with their progress on the missile delivery front; and with their pursuit of the nuclear bomb...Nuclear bombs in the hands of jihadists should be a red line for the free world.

Report: Iran missiles can now hit targets at 2,000 km range

Israeli missiles expert Uzi Rubin told Haaretz that launching a missile into the ocean at such a distance shows the Iranians’ ability to chart the course of the missiles and pinpoint the landing location. He said this was a breakthrough that would allow the Iranians to go on increasing the range of their missiles, if they so desire.

“This is the first tangible evidence that the Iranian Shihab 3 missile can actually reach that range,” said Rubin, former head of Israel’s Wall ‏(Homa‏) missile defense program. He said such a range would allow Iranians to hit targets not only in the Persian Gulf and in Israel, but also in Europe.

Palestine: EU bid to avoid UN vote on independence has failed

Palestinian leaders have declared that an EU-led attempt to revive Arab-Israeli peace talks has failed, leading them to go full-speed ahead for UN recognition instead.

Palestinian President Mahmud Abbas made the statement in Ramallah on Tuesday (11 July) following a meeting with his Greek counterpart, President Karolos Papoulias.

"We will go to the United Nations and we hope the United States will not use its veto, but that we will go with its agreement ... The fact that there is no statement from the Quartet is a negative indication that there is deep division between them," he said.

This article adds a new twist in this whole situation:

For his part, Riyad Mansour, the Palestinian ambassador to the UN, told Israeli daily Haaretz in an interview that he will submit the UN bid in "the coming weeks."

"The Americans just could not deliver the Israelis," he said on the Washington meeting, referring to the fact that Israel has rejected the idea of 1967 lines.

The Palestinians are confident that between 130 and 150 UN member states will acknowledge their bid, including a number of EU countries, such as Belgium, Denmark, France, Ireland, Luxembourg, Spain, Sweden and the UK.

Asked by Haaretz on EU support for the move, Mansour said: "Just hold tight. You will be hearing interesting news soon about it before September."

Even without UN membership, the result could cause a sea change in Israeli-Palestinian relations: Palestine could apply to join the International Criminal Court in The Hague and file suits against alleged Israeli 'war crimes', it could ask Israelis on occupied land to become Palestinian citizens or leave and it could seek extra rights as 'prisoners of war' for the 5,000-or-so Palestinians currently in Israeli jails.

The move could also enflame tensions in what is already a tinder box situation in the Middle East.

The West Courts the Muslim Brotherhood -- and Its Own Destruction

The suicidal side of the Western elites’ pervasive tendency toward fantasy-based policy making was on full display last week when the U.S. and the European Union both announced that they were opening formal contacts with the Muslim Brotherhood, a group dedicated, in its own words, to "eliminating and destroying Western civilization from within, and sabotaging its miserable house.”

The Muslim Brotherhood, contrary to "intelligence” chief James Clapper’s laughable claim that it is "largely secular,” is dedicated to establishing an Islamic state in Egypt and implementing the Islamic law that has no room for democratic principles, does indeed employ violence against dissenters and miscreants, and tramples upon minority rights and women’s rights.

The stance toward the Muslim Brotherhood that is now being adopted by both the United States and the European Union puts all free people in danger. The West is courting its own destruction.

Record year for natural disaster losses

Halfway through, this year is already the costliest on record for natural catastrophes, insurer Munich Re said Tuesday in its first-half review. Losses hit $265 billion in the first six months of 2011 – which exceeds the $220 billion in losses in the biggest previous year for natural disasters, 2005.

The question now is how high this year's record toll might rise. Munich said first-half losses "are generally lower than second-half losses, which are often affected by hurricanes in the North Atlantic and typhoons in the Northwest Pacific." Just another way in which the coming months promise to be eventful, and not in a good way.

Republicans seek documents related to Fast and Furious gun scandal

Believing that the Operation Fast and Furious scandal reaches into the highest levels of the Justice Department, congressional Republicans asked the attorney general's office to turn over a sweeping trove of emails, documents and other material to determine Washington's role in the "reckless" operation that allowed U.S. semiautomatic weapons to flow to Mexican drug cartels.

Several Washington sources, who also asked not to be identified because of the current investigation, said since the operation was managed out of the ATF field office in Phoenix, senior officials in Washington were not necessarily aware of its specifics.

When you rely on the government

I recall looking at the starving refugees in New Orleans, thinking the same thing: "When you rely on the government..."

Now we have an article addressing this very topic. This is a brief article but it hits the main points. This article is in response to Obama's comments yesterday:

Well, that appeared to be the case until President Obama called the upcoming August checks into question. He put it this way to CBS News:
"I cannot guarantee that those checks go out on August 3rd if we haven't resolved this issue. Because there may simply not be the money in the coffers to do it...."

So clearly he is now trying to use social security checks as a threat intended to force congress to agree to a tax hike.

But that is what governments can do when they "own" you. They can turn the faucet on and they can turn it off - at will. When you rely on the government they do indeed own you. Allow this at your own peril.

I'll jump to the conclusions:

So, whether its Social Security or government sponsored defined benefit plans, politicians are being shown to be poor businessmen. For years, politicians have told Americans that they need not worry, that their Social Security contributions were being put into a "lock box." Now AARP members are awaking to the "IOU" in the lock box from Uncle Sam. In fact, the only security eligible for the lock box is a special treasury note.

Imagine if a publicly traded company handled its retirement plan in such a manner -- having to borrow to make payments or only owning its own stock.

Management would be imprisoned.



Anonymous said...

Sometimes I wonder if there's any common sense left in the world

Expected Imminently said...

Not a lot! Its gone out of fashion dontcha know - far too common!

Anonymous said...

as bob dylan once gotta serve somebody, it might be the devil or it might be the Lord.
Those who aren't serving Christ ARE serving Satan! And the saga continues. It is getting darker and darker for those who dont know Yeshua. People are blinded and tricked and manipulated. no common sense left. ally

Dylan said...

Basically saying that Netanyahu will make negotiations based on the 1967 borders.

DrNofog said...

Ally, the 2 cliches I've always used are:

"Apparently common sense isn't!!"


"Common sense is highly overrated"

WVBORN56 said...

As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord!

Jesus is the King of Kings and Lord of Lords! Amen! Come Lord Jesus. Your children are waiting and watching.

Someday, every knee will bow and every tounge confess, Jesus is Lord! Why not do it voluntarily...

DrNofog said...

This makes sense!:

Runaway Elephants Nabbed by Police at Bus Stop

I guess they were gonna catch a quick ride outta town...
You can always tell when one's behind you on the bus ... can smell the peanuts on their breath...

Caver said...

Just Wow!

Never, ever, in my wildest dreams could have I imagined an ending so total, widespread, complete and in perfect step to reach a crescendo of grand final as the Lord has planned for The Grand Ending.

Its all there, economics, ME, food, evil and darkness coming out of the shadows, church turning away from The Word, love of self, signs in the stars and sky.....and on and on. And just when you think the stakes and suspense can't get a is make a joke compared to tomorrow.

Father....we are amazed...the end from the beginning....and Your children....we are ready. Somehow, however, I suspect a few more twist and turns and stops/starts are on the Master Schedule until that last gentile opens his eyes or comes of age.

Expected Imminently said...

Hello Stephen

I have fished out this link for you to consider from Twin City Fellowship – Eric Douma. He goes into the Greek tense, but it isn’t ‘heavy’. His view is the same as Reynald Showers, which is slightly different to Arnold Fruchtenbaum - but when all things are deliberated, there is no REAL difference between them. Just to be awkward I agree with both of them, it’s the ‘nuances’ that need to be mulled over.

There is a choice for audio, video and Powerpoint for free download.

April 3rd 2011 – The Day of the Lord: A look at the imminent Day of Salvation and Judgment.

There is also 2 Thess2:1-9 Gathering Together in the Light of the Coming Day of the Lord. That’s in audio and Powerpoint.

Please give them a go, you don't HAVE to agree, but it explains why and where the confusions exist.

God bless

Anonymous said...

Dear Sue....

I know you mean well, but I need to
believe in what I have evidence
for. And I will wait. As you all
know by NOW, every am I am looking
for the AC....have not found him

Several serious candidates though.
(1) Mr. Amrani at UFM
(2) Mr. Sarkosy in France

any others have lower priority.

we will see.

I feel depressed now....

the powers that BE are finding
ways to play their little games
and drop the dollar again, bull
up the Euro....

that is why GOLD is at records...


and stocks are up again.

BUT, wave counts ESPECIALLY ON
the Silver, are very bearish.

Silver just finished an ABC number
two of tonite...

WHICH means...

Big selling ahead.....

which COULD be caused by something
that the banksters cannot control.

if so, then we are going to crash.

And i think JUST MAYBE the AC
will come out of that crisis...

to unite the world.

If so, then the rapture WILL
be imminent..

There are alot of WHAT IF's

I can only watch the news like
everyone else.

Stephen in Hawaii !!!!

Waterer said...

Stephen, I am surprised that you are looking for the ac. We are commanded by Jesus to be on watch for HIM.
I think I see your desire to see that specific fulfillment of prophecy but the ten Kings are first later the Ac uproots 3 of them and rises with a bragadocious attitude. Very in your face. I believe the hour is late but we will give an account to Jesus for how we are living not how well we watched the news. Rejoice in the Lord always. Again I say rejoice.

Anonymous said...

Caver-you summed it up perfectly :)
Dylan-you inspire me always
Sweet sweet Sue-I am definately finding you fast when we are "upstairs". I'm looking first for you in the throne room at the feet of Yeshua, if you aren't there...going to look for you with the Old Testament Prophets! Can't wait!
Wv-beloved brother-you and I are going to have the coolest garden ever, supplying the wedding feast.
Doc No Fog-you will be working on the intelligence team or maybe doing stand-up comedy.
Scott-The things God has planned for you...beyond description. I got a feeling your house will be on the block with some of the "greats" of the Bible.
Stephen-I can't wait to give you a big hug! I'm sure you will be able to observe from Heaven all of the a.c.'s action if you want but I think we will be busy being happy!
To everyone I accidentally left out...It is going to be AWESOME! ally

DrNofog said...

Stephen, you need to tighten up on your spacing!

You're giving me a severe cramp in my scrolling finger!

- Ally, here's one for you:

Austria embraces pasta headgear

The Austrian transport authorities issue a driving license showing a man wearing a pasta strainer on his head, after accepting his claim that the sieve is confessional headgear in the religion of pastafarianism.

Seeing as how this's coming outta, I'm sensing that EI somehow had her noodling fingers all over that pot.

Paula said...

Next thing I know, "noodlehead" will be the new N word. o.O

Anonymous said... this is dutch's world update earthquake video (i hope i did it right) you guys might want to check it out, pretty amazing. Pastafariism lol you just make me giggle so hard no fog ally

Anonymous said...
if any of you guys live along the new madrid fault you might want to look at this. i am no seismologist and cant give you all the nuances but it is clear something is going on there right now. ally
Scott-i can tell you are busy or something is going on with you. if you need prayer or help let us know and we will pray hard for you. you might just be taking a little rest. you certainly desrve it! :) If you get a chance please look at the link in the previous post for dutch's earthquake update. I realize you look at a lot of stuff everyday esp. political things to line up. I'm really fascinated by the earthquake/storm/weather thing Jesus talked about and man, things are popping off like crazy. Plus if we can get even a little warning, many people's lives can be saved. Thanks so much! ally

Scott said...

Kathy R makes a very good point too - one that should be remembered ---> The AC won't appear until we have 10 kings - as he comes from the 10...So the world can't possibly know anything (beyond speculation) regarding the true identity of the AC until we have 10 kings.

And there is no telling how long the 10 kings will be in existence before the AC rises from this collection.

Also - as stated, Jesus instructed us to watch for Him and Him only.

Another good point IMO

Scott said...

Caver - Its always compelling to take a step back and look at the big picture - as you stated. It always amazes me how MANY of the signs (as in "all" signs) are lined up and progressing precisely as prophecy would predict. There is absolutely no way we aren't in "that" generation and at the very end of that generation - no doubt whatsoever.

Anonymous said...

Auh....Dear Stephen .....

OK, clearly you have made your choice. We just hate to see someone mis-informed and that is why so much love, support and effort has gone into providing one of our dear brothers with the truth. So no more from this end. I wouldn't be me if I didn't leave you a piece of scripture pressing from above. A gentle reminder from Matthew 6:24...

"No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon (money, wealth)"

Have a blessed night!!!


Anonymous said...

Ok, let me set the record straight.

looking for the AC.....

cause you cannot have ONE w/o the
other ...makes sense right ??

HINT>>>>>> 2 THESS 2

PLEASE take scripture for what it
says, not what you WANT it to say.

Many can question what I say,
but bottom line, I am just a
follower of Paul's words...

it does NOT matter how long it
takes, HEY, I can understand
how RUSHED everyone is to survive
to the rapture, sure, that is
preferable to physical death.

BUT, you cannot change scripture.

The gathering will simply NOT
take place until AC is


sorry if I am popping any ones's
balloon ok ??

Stephen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Dylan said...

Stephen, I think the AC might be revealed. It all depends how you interpret the scriptures. I'm just going to let God decide how he fulfills his prophecies. I believe if the AC is revealed, everyone who has eyes to see will know who the AC is. But I believe the letter to Philadelphia in revelations 3. More specifically verse 10 "Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth."

Dylan said...

Not just for Stephen, but for everyone here. Don't let this get between anyone. God will fulfill his prophecies when and how he sees fit. He's given us signs to look for, and those signs are being shown in the present day. I believe the rapture will happen before the tribulation. As for the AC being revealed before the rapture, Im not learned enough in this topic. I hope he will be, it's completely up to God though. If he is revealed, like I said in the last comment, anyone who has eyes to see will see him for who he is.

Alice said...

God bless you, Dylan!!! (((hugs)))

On the other topic... I live near, no, ON TOP OF the New Madrid fault! :/

Guess I'm gonna go see what Dutch says about it...

DrNofog said...

I thot it best to bump my reply/comment from last article up here jes 'cause things really are moving faster so it's harder to check back.

Paula, Thanx, -good link!

I wuz gonna go with my short version of the FedScam for Stephen [unless it continually progresses into the longer version]:

Since We never had any real, permanent "National Debt" until the FedRes was "created" [Privately incorporated] in 1913, we should look at how the FedRes scam was actually set up:

"We", at the behest of the Int'l Banksters and certain treasonous 'persons', decided that "we" should use "their" paper monopoly money instead of our own real, solid, "Debt-free", Gold and Silver coins...

We, by "our"[??] so-called Congress, agreed to -borrow, --NOT BUY!! -- **"BORROW"** this huge worthless wad of paper, NOT JUST ONLY AS A LOAN, ... BUT AT IT'S FULL [paper] PRINTED "MONOPOLY-MONEY" FACE-VALUE!!!

This hasta be the GREATEST SCAM in the **entire history** of the World!!! "Loaning" paper to a Nation, then charging interest on it, AND THEN, getting paid 'interest' on the scam in REAL GOLD!!

We have now been paying "them' multiple billions of $$ in "interest", right out from our real Gold and Silver deposits, on an Impossible National "Debt" that was created -out of thin air- by a simple paper entry on a phony ledger ... for simply agreeing to use "THEIR" HUGE WORTHLESS WAD OF PAPER!!!

I am severely "frosted" [to quote someone else here] when this topic comes up!!!

Paula said...

DrNo, I think we can also illustrate the Fed by a scene from the old western comedy Evil Roy Slade.

Roy's gang has a bookkeeper, who shows him that the gang is broke. Roy pulls out his pistol and points at the booky's head and says, "You write $50,000 in that book of yours!" The guy nervously writes the numbers. Then Roy says, "Now where's my money?!" The booky offers up an approaching train carrying cash to a nearby town, and off goes the gang to rob it.

Evil Fed Reserve!

Anonymous said...

Hi Stephen~

I hope all is well with you today. I read your post and it still makes me grin. I do understand your thinking but unfortunately that is not where I am supposed to follow. I love all you the same. It’s funny how things work out though. I went to the library yesterday with my daughter because I wanted to find that Andy Stanley book that was recommended here. Sad to say they didn’t have it. Another one jumped out at me so I came home and started to read it. It’s wonderful, at least I think so :) It’s called It’s Not About Me – by Max Lucado.

My response here has some bits and pieces of wisdom and insights that I have obtain in this book in just a short time. The other part is just me lovingly sharing with you and anyone else who may be new to this forum and get confused about this topic we have been discussing. You can chase the AC, no one is going to stop you. You have free will. How you use it is up to you. We love you no matter what. As Christians it is our responsibility not to mislead others down that path and for that reason I am responding to your recent statement.

Many successful men and women are moved by their own success believing they don’t need anyone else’s input. As Christians we are held to a different level of accountability amongst each other. We are to have a shared, sound biblical thinking all the while grounded in the word which is designed for God’s plan and purposes for our lives. That is why we share openly here without attack and accept and learn ideas or correct our thinking in love. It’s not about us but pleasing our Father, God.

God doesn’t exist to make a big deal out of us. We exist to make a big deal out of him. Sure we all have been told in life to “look out for number one” but as Christians we are to make sure we watch out for Christ. God’s plans are mind-blowing to say the least.

Don’t you want to see God’s radiance; more of God and not more of the world? The fascination of his wondrous beauties all around us that ones that he created; as the creator, the immense creator? A God so Mighty that he can commission the birds and command the fish? A God that can move mountains!

What you implied in your statement is known as escapism. True, while to most non-Christians or even new Christians who do not have a better understanding of the Lord that would seem like the easiest way out. I assure you that is not me. From what I have seen on this forum we acknowledge God’s grace and all the glory goes to him and him alone. I have seen many times a new post to redirect our attentions to look up to God. We are to be like the watchman watching for the Lord not his rival.

I am so excited to see my heavenly Father and to move onto his next part of my journey with him. These times have been laid out as the time for his return, so why can’t we be excited to go home? It’s not like we are mid-cycle in this story and are sitting idly by waiting for his return and not living life, right? I do not want to go home a minute sooner than he desires for us because as it states in Ephesians 1:20-22…

Ephesians 1:20-22(AMP)

20Which He exerted in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His [own] right hand in the heavenly [places],
21Far above all rule and authority and power and dominion and every name that is named [above every title that can be conferred], not only in this age and in this world, but also in the age and the world which are to come.
22And He has put all things under His feet and has appointed Him the universal and supreme Head of the church [a headship exercised throughout the church],

So, instead of what do I want, I live by what does God want? While we wait-My pain expands God’s purpose-not proves God’s absence.

God Bless!!

Anonymous said...

Hi Ally~

Here are some chem-trails I spotted at 8:30am this morning. I checked Dutch's site and didn't here anything so far about bad weather here. If I missed something can someone let me know? What usually happens is within 24-48 hours of these trails the weather get's pretty severe. I would greatly appreciate it :)

Have a blessed day!


WVBORN56 said...

Nicely said GG...thanks for the remninder... "not my will Oh Lord but thy will be done."

Scott said...

That was so well stated. Thanks a lot for that :)

Anonymous said...

Hi GG-the severe weather is created by radio (microwaves)waves. They create telltale circles called ring returns that are visible on radar. Usually in the center of the circle is where the most severe weather occurs. This is done by haarp which is a skalar system. Dutch and others look for the rings on radar systems that are available to weathermen and scientists.
Chemtrails are different. They are spayed from airplanes and contain numerous heavy metals, chemicals and poisons. Some things that we know for sure they are dropping are aluminum and barium. Apparently some chemtrail chemicals make it easier for the microwaves to heat the air which in turn causes the extreme weather. Some other uses of chemtrails are to destroy the soil so plants for food won't grow (Shasta,Ca. residents tried to sue the gov't over this recently)The extremely thick chemtrail spraying is to make it hard for us to see the sky clearly. The chemicals also can make us sick :( but we have Jesus's stripes so we will all be fine!
There is speculation that somehow ct's are being used to prep the skies for project bluebeams "fake rapture" project enoch but who knows? Not me! LOL
I just keep looking up cuz my redeemer LIVES! Keep the faith guys, each almost unbelievable crazy thing that happens puts us closer to the wedding! I get giddy thinking about all that love! Don't you? ally

Anonymous said...

Hi Ally-

Thanks for the clarification on that. A friend of mine was saying he wouldn't be surprised that it starts effecting population abilities. I will watch and see what the next couple of days bring. 2 storms before this one I saw some Chem trails going up and down in the evening aroung 6 or so. Not the left or right like a plane flies but straight up like a rocket would take off. They were close in their double trail going upward. Then they disappeared within 15 minutes. I was driving so I couldn't snap that one. 2 days later we were hit with a storm that sent off the tornado sirens. There were to be no storms at all. I guess I want to see if these chem trails are the prelude to the harp rings thus causing both to create a storm situation. Hmmmm... Maybe it just fell at the same time the haarp rings were detected but I didn't know about Dutch then. You guys have been a Godsend with his info. Hope your new job is going great :)